Barbara: Hi everyone. And welcome to 40 minutes of faith. My name is Barbara Cox and I host this weekly podcast to explore God's word and our relationship with God.
Today's guest is Jeff Cox. I met Jeff in Salem, Massachusetts in the 1990s, when we were both earning social work degrees. He's from Indiana and has served a variety of people as a social worker from youth to senior citizens, to members of the United States armed forces and veterans.
He's currently a social work supervisor at Fort drum, New York, and a reservist in the army. Welcome, Jeff. I usually ask guests how things are in their area- today I'd be interested in hearing if you experienced any reverse culture shock after returning to the United States from five years of living in Europe?
Jeff: Well, Barbara, in some respects I have, after being in Europe for five years, and you see how things seem to be smaller. And there is less preoccupation on big and a more preoccupation on sustainability. It does rub off on you. And there's a lot of lessons that we can learn from Europe. On the other hand, Europeans dream big as well. And they would love to be in New York state or wherever, driving big trucks and doing big things. So it's kind of a balance, but I'm happy to be back and happy to be on the program today.
Barbara: What's one example of sustainability that you noticed in Europe, that seems to be absent, at least in the current area?
Jeff: if you go to Germany, for example, but especially in the Netherlands, you'll see paths along the road and every place and these paths are actually separated for walking and for riding. These paths are well-maintained mostly and people are encouraged. So even in rural areas, you would see paths and especially in urban areas and you would have people riding their bicycles, now electric bicycles around, and they would be fine.
They would actually be somewhat healthier. And we know that exercise and depression have a relationship and people were more connected. I find in the States, when we try to do something, it's considered a novelty, not a right. And a lot of these paths once they are installed, I mean, they have to be maintained, but the amount of usage is remarkable.
Barbara, the Germans actually have created a highway for bicycles across Germany. Multiple kilometers. Which is something that they feel that people would want to commute both recreationally and for a business.
Barbara: Thanks for letting us know those interesting tidbits, Jeff. Today we have a Bible passage from the book of second Timothy, which is towards the back of your Bible, almost all the way to the end.
And in my Lutheran study Bible, I just have a few sentences to let you know about the books of first Timothy and second Timothy. So from the Lutheran study Bible on page 1,959, it says Paul is in prison in Rome, awaiting his death. Most of his coworkers and friends have left him in this time of personal suffering.
Paul is shown writing an affectionate letter to Timothy, urging him to carry on with ministry to do this. He will need to oppose false teachings as discussed in first Timothy. So for more information, see first Timothy, but for today, I'm going to read a passage from second Timothy verses eight to 14 in chapter one from the Inclusive Bible.
“So don't be ashamed to give your testimony about Christ and don't be ashamed of me, Christ's prisoner. But join with me in suffering for the gospel, by the power of God who has saved us and called us to a Holy life- not because of anything we have done, but because of God's own purpose and grace. This grace was given to us in Christ Jesus before the beginning of time, but it has now been revealed through the appearing of our savior Jesus Christ, who has destroyed death and brought life and immortality to light through the gospel. And it was for this gospel that I was appointed a Herald and an apostle and a teacher. That's why I'm suffering as I am. Yet I'm not ashamed because I know whom I have believed, and I'm convinced that Jesus Christ is able to guard what has been entrusted to me until that final day. Take what you have heard me say as a model of sound teaching in faith and love in Christ Jesus. Guard the rich deposit of faith with the help of the Holy spirit who dwells within us.
Jeff, why did you select this Bible passage?
Jeff: as we are moving into 2021, I was remarked about the concept of life as a Holy calling, and the commitment on how we and our individual places of work and our individual places of life is a Holy calling and how we both live our faith, understand our faith and are in community with each other on our faith helps us grow and sustain.
Barbara: Is second Timothy or both of the Timothys together, your favorite books of the Bible, or just this passage felt meaningful for you at this time?
Jeff: this passage feels meaningful for me now, because it really does speak about the apostle Saint Paul and how in his sense of desperation being in prison being harassed and probably beaten, how he was able to continue to talk about how Jesus was the light of the world. And I think that more importantly, he speaks about his unashamed belief in this and how this belief can be transformational.
Barbara: in my Lutheran study Bible, it mentions that the Timothys may have been written by Paul, but there is some scholarly question. It may have been written by someone else. They can tell just by tone and grammar and things like that.
How do we go about, Jeff, seeking a Holy calling in our daily work?
Jeff: the first way we do this is by being rooted in study by being in a community or in this case, a Christian community, and that seeing our daily life and work are an expression of our baptismal commitment. Specifically, I think that we have to see, whether we're taking care of children, whether we're taking care of parents, whether we're taking care of a dog or cat, how we work in our work, whether our workplaces, a manager or as a direct support, or even in a retail sense, someone who distributes goods and receives money- in every case, how we act and how we relate is part of our faith and is part of our testimony. I mean, we think about our teachers and there may be one or two teachers listening today. And I want to just emphasize how we are transformed by our teachers. They may not be necessarily speaking at length about the Bible but they are living their faith. They are living their commitment. They are helping people be transformed in their life. Seeing that they have opportunities to be the best barber or to be a meaningful cook or a meaningful scientist or a mathematician. And that is one of the gifts that teaching offers. So I think that we particularly in church today, talk a lot about clergy and maybe a lot about other church leaders, but we may not emphasize enough about the daily work of the people, the the laity of God and how that work is transformative in our world in our daily planet.
Barbara: So I'm hearing you say that you don't have to necessarily have a career in a church or in a faith setting, just everyday ordinary people have a mission to share essentially God's love with everyone, even if it's not in a faith-based setting. Any other thoughts on that, Jeff?
Jeff: Yeah, let me just say something- more people whose understanding of religion and faith may not be very traditional in a Christian sense, even folks like that, how they live and how they follow through is key. I was looking at buying a car recently and I was with one of the car salesmen and he was talking to me about how this was his vocation, his life work, selling cars for the last eight or nine years. And trust me, this last year has been a very tough year for car salesman and how he sees his customers as important and want to help them be successful. And he believes by having the gift to help then be successful, he will turn around and will have more success.
And that has always been a tradition, especially in Protestantism. But in every part of the Christian experience is by study and by having a strong ethics we end up getting better in our life and we are economically better and our families are better and our lives are better.
Barbara: I want to go back to what you said a few minutes ago about fulfilling our baptismal vows, because that's something that people who practice in a more liturgical tradition are probably more familiar with, but I just want to check in, when you say fulfilling our baptismal vows. What does that mean to you, either if it was an infant that was baptized or someone who may have been older?
Jeff: I think if you look at the liturgy, what's being said is often, do you renounce evil? Do you strive for good? Do you strive for this way called the Christian way, which is not about being perfect, but is living in the grace and love of God?
And do you want to be part of this community that will hopefully guide you and strive you, and then you are given that name? Through water and later sealed in oil, confirmed in oil that we are Christ's own forever, that this experience is a lived experience. It's not simply a experience where your name goes on a roster.
And we're very proud of that. And we have a birthday party. I mean, in some respects it has been a naming ceremony, a public ceremony, especially for infants to name, but it is an opportunity to say that this community, this faith, this tradition, that this person's potential is far greater than what we know.
And only God in this community and themselves in particular can make that happen.
Barbara: So in many faith traditions, the adults speak these words on behalf of the child. If it's an infant, obviously they can't talk. And the adults promise to guide the child as they grow. And one thing that you mentioned that I just wanted to explain, probably a lot of people are familiar with the concept of water at baptism. In many traditions, the infant or child is held and some water is poured over their head. Other faith traditions have full immersion where the whole body goes in and comes right back out. And the oil that you had mentioned to the best of my understanding, is the officiating person, clergy person puts a drop of oil on their finger and makes the Mark of a cross on the forehead of the person being baptized. So I just wanted to explain those traditions.
And it sounds like the baptismal vows that we live then as adults is sort of continuing this language that was brought either as infants or whenever you were baptized at whatever age that we want to continue to live our lives in this way, that this calling isn't just sort of a one and done you're baptized and that's it, then you kind of go on with your life. Any other thoughts on that? Jeff?
Jeff: I think that the oil is often not talked a lot about, but in liturgical traditions, you'll see this in the Roman Catholic church, in Orthodox church and it could be any tradition. Oils are blessed, particularly during Holy week, during a particular part of the year, but they are a sign of what was done was sealed.
Think of it as a seal, you know, nowadays we have like scotch tape, but the reality is it's a sealing of what is done and that sealing is done by the church. Okay. So an officiate of the church seals that person- if you think about it, there's other times that oil is used Ash Wednesday, you know, oil and ashes are put together and placed on people's heads to remember that they are sealed that their death will be, forthcoming or could be forthcoming and that we are sealed in God's promise in a very solemn way.
We also are sealed in times when we seek healing, there is anointing of that same oil. So that oil is used in life, is used in death. And is used all the time to keep and sustain people.
Barbara: I was very moved by an experience that I'm going to ask you about in a minute, Jeff. And I promise we'll get back to Timothy, but just this talking about the oil is a great time for me to ask a question. When I was at a Lutheran church in Texas, I had a really amazing experience there. It was a wonderful congregation. And a lot of churches do things in an orderly way. I used to laugh on Prairie Home Companion, which was a radio show that we listened to many years ago. They had jokes about there were ushering competitions in Minnesota - I may not be remembering all the details correctly where ushering teams would compete. And I'm pretty sure this was a joke, but it might not be, on how to guide people to the front of the sanctuary at the appropriate times. Depending on how many aisles you had, who went, where, but anyway, at this Lutheran church in Texas, when the pastor said, come for communion, people ran from their pews to go to the front of the church to get communion.
There were no ushers leading people from the front Pew or the back Pew or whatever. And then after communion off to the side, so at the same time, but people would first go to receive communion and then they would go to the side. They had lay ministers, who were praying with people.
And I've seen that before in many churches too, and they had oil for anointing. And I don't remember ever seeing that before. So I'm wondering, is that part of what you're talking about, Jeff, are you a little bit more familiar with that anointing of oil after prayers? Just on any regular Sunday?
Jeff: Let me just say quickly about the ushering, is in a lot of African-American congregations ushering is a tremendous honor, and actually there are uniforms. And then there are expectations. Ushering is seen as a place of security. We are now finding that churches are utilizing for their own kind of force protection around people coming in with weapons and so forth. So ushering is a very important gift. It's a gift of greeting and hospitality .
Now praying for the sick is a sacrament in some liturgical traditions and in many ways is a blessing for every tradition. So yes, anointing with oil throughout scripture has been shown as God's sense of healing and that special oil or any oil that may be available helps promote that. Healing ministries have been around well probably before Jesus' day, but they continue today and we reclaim them. We think of St Stephen's ministries, which is a lay ran pastoral ministry, but we also think about how the sacrament is a sacrament and addition of healing.
And that opportunity for people to come up and receive a blessing and ask for God's anointing in their life to change their healing that may not be curable. But is knowing that God will take their suffering and help them live in their suffering rather than forgive it. We in a society want to avoid suffering as much as we can.
And so the realizing how much suffering is in our society is in our life and how we can live in suffering is our way forward so that we do not suffer even more. So anointing and healing and oil are all part of the Christian experience.
Barbara: I hadn't meant to mock or make fun of ushering. I had a very positive experience with ushers, exactly like you had said, Jeff, at the gospel service at Vogelweh, Germany, which is part of the Ramstein American military footprint there. And they gave everybody hugs coming in. And for some people that may have been the only hug or one of just a few hugs that they got the whole week and they had uniforms and everything was really helpful. That was a tremendous service within the community. So thank you for that.
I have one more piece of information for you from the Lutheran study Bible, and then we'll keep delving into these verses. So just on the following page of the introduction to second Timothy, it says this letter teaches that there are practical consequences to faith in Jesus Christ. Dietrich Bonhoeffer, a Lutheran pastor, called faith that avoids practical consequences “cheap grace”. In contrast to this, Bonhoeffer believed that God's grace and faith in Christ compelled him to fight the regime of Nazi Germany, which led to his arrest and execution.
So second Timothy is a call to persist courageously in the ministry of Jesus Christ. So you had talked a little bit about suffering, Jeff, and I think this is a really important point. Can you speak a little bit more about suffering?
Jeff: in many ways we spend so much energy avoiding suffering that we end up suffering more. The best way to address suffering is to live in it and to realize it is the case. And not to say that pain doesn't exist or to avoid it or to do something that is wrong, but is to be involved. And we talk about confession as another aspect of the Christian experience and confession is speaking your truth, the truth about what is going on and asking for God's help and anointing -now we're back to the oil- in their life. And I think that the key that the Christian experience is most meaningful is when we can be truthful in the experience of the Christian tradition, has rules, mores and expectations. And they really are kind of found in, if you think about the 10 commandments and you think about the Lord's prayer and the golden rule in lots of ways, the simple way is more simple- love your neighbor as yourself. You have to love yourself first so that you can love your neighbor more. So if you're suffering and you're not loving yourself, it is extremely hard to love others in your family or other places. So I would tell folks the key is start loving yourself to accept your suffering and realizing suffering exists.
And then through that, you might be well to find relief, whether it's relief from physical pain relief, from problematic relationships or difficult employment, relief from unbearable economic situations or cultural or societal discrimination. Or relief that you have crowds suffering, or if I could use the word trained generational suffering.
So we have realized, and I'm a veteran myself, is that the children of veterans oftentimes suffer as much if not more than the veterans, because the veterans have given their suffering to their children. The veteran is the one who gets all the credit, the children often not.
So there are ways which we can come up and find reconciliation and we can find wholeness and hopefully we can find a more true and broader life. I mean, going back to second Timothy, I think that St Paul addresses about God's grace that we are not expected to be able to do all of this with our own power, but that we have God who is in our life, who has that power and that possibility.
And that is key in knowing that we don't have to hold it all up, that we can, as we would say through our prayers, that we give it to God.
Barbara: I also want to preface something that is unspoken just until now. And that is yes, we are to love our neighbors as ourselves. And right before that is, we are to love God with all our strength and our mind and our heart and our soul. So this isn't a simple formula. Like first, if you love yourself, then you love your neighbors and then all your suffering will be gone. And you're not saying that Jeff, but I just kind of want to make that clear.
Jeff: I'm not saying that at all. In a lot of ways. It's difficult to love others if we cannot love ourselves. And I think in the Christian tradition, we struggle because we want people to love God, but they do not even love themselves. There is no model for love - so for a long time, we said, God is your father. Well, some folks have had real problematic relationships with males or other folks, or struggle with seeing that as a model. I think for many people, it is still a very valid model and certainly a model for me. But I definitely think that we have to find our sense of peace and that peace is through Jesus.
And that is what kept St. Paul going every day as he was writing that letter in the prison and he was exhorting the community through Timothy to continue on, even in their conflict amongst their suffering, persecution.
Barbara: another point that you had mentioned earlier is about being in study and there's a lot of different ways to do that. Especially nowadays, there are fewer in-person gatherings due to the pandemic, and sometimes individual study is very fruitful and meaningful and for some people, individual study just isn't quite enough. Do you have any thoughts on some of the different ways that we can be in study that you had mentioned earlier?
Jeff: there's two ways to look at the time when you are apart from your community, whether it's a pandemic or you are In a different location, deployed , or more importantly, you're not able to attend. You're sick, you have to work. So we now have more means than ever to find community.
So we do encourage in the Christian sense to, you know, to find community and local congregation because the local congregation is your local mission. And is your local opportunity for pastoral health and healing. But there are wonderful opportunities through your public library, podcasts that were non thinkable several years ago. We can find community online that didn't exist. But we really do want to look at what the scriptures say, love your neighbor. I think we could say, Oh, my neighbor is my zoom group or whatever, but I also think my neighbor is also my next door neighbor. And the challenge is, is how do I know who my neighbor is and how do I engage my neighbor? I live in a neighborhood where a lot of my neighbors are very fearful of others because they take care of older folks or they have diseases of their own, but they want to be engaged by telephone, by wave. Even when they walk down the street, they want to be engaged. And I think that that is something very important. We can be engaged with folks we see at the gym. If we go to the gym or church, or even in our workplace, even if our workplace is virtual or our children, or our helping our children go to school or community groups like Scouts or a soccer club.
There's a lot of ways to engage people and to care and to ask how are you, how are you really? And to be present.
Barbara: I had actually recently done an online search that you are also welcome to do for yourself. I don't have a specific list of websites, but if you search free online Bible study, you'll find a lot of different sources.
Now, some of these. Places encourage you to purchase a book or a study guide or something like that, there's even subscription video services for faith-based groups. So if you pay a certain amount of money per month, say $7 or something like that, then you have access to all these Bible study videos.
So depending on what your learning style is, there's ranges from free to buy a book to buy some digital study, as well as of course, just spending your own time in God's word. And I know I have mentioned some study Bibles that have questions in the margins. I have participated in Bible studies over zoom, which is great.
And there's been Facebook studies, believe it or not. And there's a lot of ways of viewing church services or other faith groups online for free as well. So you don't have to pay, but just to give you an idea of the different range of options that might be available, and then philosophically, of course, that might be a consideration for some people to pay attention to, are the basic beliefs here fairly in alignment with what I believe? And am I gaining in my faith walk by spending some time here in this place with these people, with these authors? And then Jeff, I do have one more question for you. When you had mentioned about suffering, sometimes we pray that our suffering can be relieved and then sometimes the suffering keeps going.
And so we're trying to make sense of that. And as we are looking at a new year coming from, what's been a very difficult year for many people, the Bible verse talks about guard the good treasure entrusted to you with the help of the Holy spirit. What does that mean to you, Jeff?
Jeff: The good treasure that God has given us his word, his community, his teachings, and his life, the life of Jesus born and died and was crucified and came back.
That is the treasurer that we are given. And I think the key is to find that treasure in us and live it through us. But we have to be able to love us and then love others to be able to see it. That's it easier said than done. That's what good pastoral counseling, spiritual direction counseling, therapy, prayer, study, and other recognized and well endorsed ways to find that.
But utilizing the spiritual gifts that the church offers that these are treasures that are meant to be used, not stored away, like Christmas ornaments that come out for a couple of weeks out of the year. And they have to be nourished and they have to be improved upon- sometimes they break.
And they have to be repaired, but I think it's important to everyone, and I say this to myself, more importantly, that your practice is the key and how you practice and how much time you give is the key, especially when you need it. So I encourage everyone, as you look at second Timothy 1:8-14 is to see Paul's testimony about not being ashamed, knowing that Christ is real is a real treasure and that by putting trust and faith in this, we can find that life, which is everlasting.
Barbara: Jeff, one question that I like to ask from one of my professors at school is whose voice is missing? We've had a great conversation about this passage in second Timothy, we've talked about suffering and study and neighbors, whose voice is missing?
Jeff: Probably your listener’s voice is missing. I would encourage everyone to reach out through comments. It's easy to find a million ways on how we cannot move ahead with the gospel.
We can live in an ideal community that maybe existed for a year or two when we were eight to 10, instead of the communities that we exist in today that are not ideal, but I would encourage you. One of the signs of maturity in faith and in life is to not live in nostalgia alone. But to live in reality today and to hopefully improve upon reality so that the gifts we give to future generations are even better.
A foundation built, not on sand, but on God's word, love, and hope.
Barbara: I would also like to suggest that some of us might feel like we are sort of imprisoned with all these safety practices around staying home or not being able to go to all these places that we might want to go to. But I know I'm not really in jail. I might feel like it, but I am definitely not. I am free. And I want to lift up our siblings who are imprisoned either literally, or perhaps figuratively in a more severe way than I am. I would just like to lift up in prayer, our siblings who are trapped in various different ways, whether it's literally behind bars of a correctional facility or behind bars that maybe have been made by other people that are not part of the official system. That again, lifting in prayer and in hope like Jeff said, and knowing that a lot of people feel like their voices, aren't heard, not just people who are in imprisoned. That we want to listen for each others. So reaching out like Jeff said, and then also listening, I would just like to offer for that up praying for one another and then listening that there are people who don't feel heard and who are not heard, or we think we've heard them.
And maybe we've heard the same story every year for decades. But there might be more to it or the people who are very quiet who have deep thoughts and deep feelings, that we want to honor their experiences in life too. Is there anything else Jeff, that you would like to say regarding either second Timothy or any of the themes that we've talked about today?
Jeff: I just wanted to say how proud I am Barbara of you doing this podcast and the commitment that you had over this past year to have this personal ministry, to reach out and to make a difference in this world, utilizing this modern-day technology. I think that how you did this podcast is a good example of how all of us can live.
You did not have the immediate tools to know how to do a podcast. So you had to find a teacher and take the course. You didn't have the immediate physical tools to be able to do this podcast. So you had to get a microphone and get the technology to be able to do it. And you didn't live in a household of 25 people that would be guests on your podcast.
So you had to reach out to your community and friends and be able to bring this all together. And in many ways we may have a dream that we want to live. And as this podcast is one of your dreams, I encourage each and every one of your listeners to find their dream. To find a teacher to find the technology and define the perseverance through the hope to give their treasure of a dream to others.
Barbara: Thank you for that encouragement and the support. And I also want to just throw in there about dreams. I know that many of you already know this firsthand. Some dreams just sit around for a while, right? And you just wonder well, Hey, when is this dream going to happen? And then sometimes dreams might change a little bit too.
I had first imagined that I could have a radio show Bible study with live call-ins and a big support team standing by to help callers with their problems. And you never know, that might still happen, but right now this is a step of a dream of reaching out to people and offering words of love and support and encouragement, knowing that that's something that some people don't hear very frequently.
So is there room for dreams to grow like seeds underground, and you think, well, nothing's happening for a really long time? I planted some seeds on Memorial day weekend because that's when they say it's safe to plant seeds where I live and I was waiting in June and I was waiting in July and I was waiting in August.
And I'm thinking, come on, you guys, it's going to start to snow soon. Let's go. And many dreams, linger for much longer than just a few months. And then is there room for dreams to maybe shift a little bit or change how they look or change how they come about or come about in one way and then maybe change later on?
Thank you, Jeff, for your time today, it's been excellent learning more about Timothy and this passage and baptism and oil and suffering and calling and study.
Jeff: Thank you very much, Barbara. And but God's blessings beyond all of us this day forth and forevermore.
Amen.
Resources:
2 Timothy 1:8-14
Jeff serves military members and veterans in New York state and in other locations